Putting One Word After Another: An Interview with Joseph M. Schuster

Not too long ago, I mentioned that I stumbled upon a book by another SchusterThe Might Have Been by Joseph M. Schuster. Given the coincidence of our last names, idle curiosity drove me to read it. Once I picked it up, however, Schuster’s writing wouldn’t let me put the book down. Touching on baseball, life, dreams, disappointment, hope, tenacity, and the passage of time, The Might Have Been is the perfect summer read.

Almost immediately after I finished reading his novel, I had to drop the author a line to ask a few questions about the writing process — and he got back to me almost immediately. So he’s not just a great writer, but he’s also a hell of a guy. Must be something about the name!

Can you tell us a little bit about your novel and what inspired it?

The Might Have Been is about a character named Edward Everett Yates who, as the novel opens, is just getting the word that he’s been promoted to the major leagues, specifically to the St. Louis Cardinals, after ten years of bouncing around in the minors. Three weeks later, however, he suffers a devastating knee injury in a game, ending his season and the Cardinals release him. For a while he tries to live outside baseball but can’t let the game go and so he ends up back in it, in the minors again – and then, suddenly, it’s thirty years later and he’s still stuck in the low minors, managing a broken down team.

The novel started one day when I sat down to write after a sentence occurred to me that went something like, “The best summer of his life, he was twenty-four.” I don’t know where the sentence came from, but I thought that seemed a little sad – to have the best year of your life when you’re twenty-four would suggest your life didn’t go as you might have liked. (In revision, my character became 27.) I wondered, what kind of person might have such a life and I thought, well, an athlete. And since baseball is the sport I know best, he became a ballplayer in the second sentence.

For a long time, I’ve been fascinated with so-called cup-of-coffee players – ballplayers who get to the major leagues but stick it out for only a few games or a couple of weeks and then are gone – long enough for a metaphorical cup of coffee. To even reach the major leagues means that a player is amazing. I once read that only one out of every ten men who play minor league ball ever get to the major leagues, even for an inning. And the idea that someone would be that good but not be able to stick, just seems sad to me.

I have interviewed and written about quite a few ballplayers who are like that and so my main character is not so much based on any one of them but is an expression of my ideas of the lives that some of those players have had.

One player who struck me in particular was a guy named Glenn Gardner, who pitched in 17 games for the Cardinals in 1945, when he was 29, and then was back in the minor leagues the next season. He stuck it out in the minors for some years after that, ending up as a player-manager in a class-C team in the 1950s before he gave up baseball. He later became a bartender and he died in his 40s of cirrhosis. A few years ago, I went to the Baseball Hall of Fame at Cooperstown and spent a couple of days in their library, researching players like Gardner, and came across a letter his widow had written to a researcher back in the 1960s, after Gardner died. The researcher had contacted her to check on some facts about Gardner and in her reply, she asked if the Hall of Fame had any money for widows of former baseball players. She added, “which I could certainly use.” That letter opened up a world to me, a world of the consequences of the decisions we make when we’re younger and that affect our lives and the lives of others for years and decades later.

The Might Have Been begins in 1976 and takes readers to the present day. With such a sweeping timeline, was it difficult to decide what to leave in the narrative and what to take out? How did you decide? Did you leave anything on the cutting room floor, as it were?

I am a terribly sloppy writer when I am working on my first draft. I generally have no idea where I am going and so end up writing a lot that gets cut. To produce the 500-page finished first draft of the novel, something with a narrative that at least passes for coherent, I wrote probably 1,000 pages. For example, at one point, I wrote a fifty- sixty-page section that was about Edward Everett’s mother going to New York City to try to be a singer after she graduates from high school during the early 1940s. Before I decided that it would be about a character who could never get out of baseball, Edward Everett  was a sports editor for a weekly “throwaway.” I wrote I don’t know how many pages about a relationship that his mother had with the man who used to be their parish pastor but who left the priesthood after he fell in love with Edward Everett’s mother after she was widowed.

Getting from that very messy first draft to the finished novel took nine years and nine drafts – and I was making some pretty significant changes even in that ninth draft.

Baseball breaks the heart of your protagonist, Edward Everett Yates, on many occasions, yet he sticks with it. As I read the novel, I kept thinking about all of the writers I know, and how our dogged pursuit writing involves similar instances of heartbreak. Do you see a parallel between writing and baseball?

I see a parallel between baseball and pretty much everything we do in life but, yes, I see a parallel between writing and baseball. For a while, I tried to keep a blog (I stopped because I didn’t have the time to post regularly). I called it “Writing is Damn Hard” and it consists of entries about writing and many of them use some sort of analogy from sport; one specifically looks at baseball: The Eric Bruntlet School of Writing.

More than any other major sport, baseball mirrors life, since there are games every day in season, instead of only on Sunday or only a couple of days a week. Baseball, therefore, is a sport in which just showing up seems all the more important. Every time I go to a ballgame, I buy a scorecard and keep score, batter by batter, inning by inning, and one of the things that strikes me about those scorecards are all of the 4-3 or 6-3 ground outs – ground ball to second or shortstop. That’s how teams win ballgames – not so much by the plays that end up on the MLB Network or ESPN highlight shows – those are great and those are dramatic and they do influence a game – but more often, it’s just a shortstop or a second baseman just doing what he’s done a thousand times before – fielding the ground ball and throwing to first – that wins ballgames. And, as writers, that’s how we get our work done: showing up, putting one word after another after another, day after day after day.

Along similar lines, I was wondering if there´s any extent to which your own experiences as a writer—hopes, fears, heartbreaks, successes—informed your sense of Edward Everett´s emotional compass.

Honestly, yes, very much so. I’m older than the large majority of people who publish their first novel – I am a bit younger than Edward Everett, but not by too many years. That means that I am very much aware of choices I’ve made in my life and that my life is whatever it is because of those choices and because of chance and accident. I happen to like my life, even though it’s different than I imagined it would be when I was 18, but I have seen far too many people who are my age or a bit older who are unhappy, full of regret, and even bitter about how their lives have turned out. I remember a few years ago I was in the locker room for the gym at the school where I teach, changing to do a workout. I ran into a colleague who was in his late 60s or maybe he was even 70 and he was retiring that year after thirty-something years on the faculty. I didn’t know him well – we were friendly but certainly not friends; we’d probably never had a conversation that was more than a few sentences and most of our encounters were the polite, “Hi, how are you” variety. So it surprised me when he looked up to see me coming into the locker room, where he was changing after doing his own workout, sat down on the bench, shook his head, and said, “I never meant to stay here this long. I thought I’d be here for two years and then move on somewhere else.” His Ph.D. was from an Ivy League school and Webster University is a good school but it’s not an Ivy League institution.

The fact that we didn’t have the sort of relationship in which he’d ordinarily admit something like that to me suggested even more the depth of his regret. And, while my novel is about a baseball player, it’s just as much about that moment that many people have when they reach a certain point in life and think about where they were when they were young, what they wanted, and how things have turned out.

At one point, my novel makes a 30-year leap, between the end of one section and the beginning of the next, and I did that for a reason – the fact that on one page it’s 1977 and on the next it’s 2009 – to capture that feeling that many people have of shock when they realize that suddenly thirty years have passed and this is where they are, whether it was how they intended to be on the front side of those thirty years.

Edward Everett´s vast body of experience—at one point he calculates that he´s logged over 10,000 hours of game time-allows him to serve as an effective mentor for many young ball players. Do you have any advice for writers who are just venturing into the writing game?

At one point in my novel, I talk a little bit about cliches that baseball players use when sportswriters interview them – you play them one game at a time; if you have a bad game, you have to leave it behind and not let it affect your next game, etc. – and Edward

Everett thinks about how his players have to learn that the reason the cliches are the cliches is that there is truth in them – that there’s a reason cliches become cliches.

I believe that, though I don’t want to suggest we should write in cliches, and so what I am going to say may sound as if I am only spouting what other people have said but I really do believe these things:

1. Show up every day, sit down to write and keep your butt in the chair. Set a quota for yourself and work until you meet it. For most of the time I was writing my novel, I had a quota of 1,500 words a day and I wasn’t allowed to stop writing until I reached 1,500 words. On some days, that was a couple of hours and on others, it was seven or eight or ten hours. But you can’t finish anything if you don’t sit down and if you don’t keep working.

2. Write what moves you, write stories that you think are important or that you think are interesting. It’s hard enough to write and you have no guarantee that anyone will publish what you write and so if you’re not enjoying it or if you’re not finding it worthwhile, what’s the point?

3. Write not knowing where you’re going. I find that if I know exactly where I want to end up when I write my first sentence, what I write will be dead dead dead. If I am not discovering something as I go, it won’t go very far and it won’t be interesting to the reader.

4. Write more and submit less and revise revise revise. I know it’s wonderful to publish something but I think too many writers send out their work before it’s as good as they can make it. This is particularly true if you’re working on a book. It’s hard to write a novel and so it doesn’t make sense not to make it as good as you possibly can. It’s also harder to sell a novel and so even for commercial reasons it doesn’t make sense not to make a novel as good as you can make it before you try to send it out. If you send out a manuscript before it’s polished, you end up closing doors, rather than opening them. If you send a manuscript to an agent or an editor before it’s ready, and they say “no,” you can’t contact them six months later and say, “Do you remember that novel you rejected back in May? Well, it’s better now.” They’re not going to be willing to read it.

12 comments

    1. If you read my first novel, The Singular Exploits of Wonder Mom & Party Girl, you’ll probably like the character called Captain Panther.

      1. Hmmm, that one does sound appealing, is it available on ITunes??? If I’m in a rush, I don’t wait for the library. Thank you, Marc! Was it my gravatar that gave it away? LOL :D

      2. Let’s call the gravatar a hint! I don’t think it’s on iTunes, but it’s available for Kindle and other e-formats.

  1. Damn, man, this was the most riviting interview of yours I’ve read so far.

    Perhaps being of similar age to the Other Mr. Schuster, I’ve noticed much the same in “my world.” And it is sad. Our lives are what we create of them–but they are also GREATER than the sum of their parts. We need to realize this and behave accordingly. Enjoy life more, not always being trying to “wish our lives away,” as it were. “Living for the weekends.” Living in fear of growing older. I know it’s tough when things don’t turn out as we’d like, but there are reasons for this…and that’s for EACH OF US to determine for ourselves.

    I see so many teens and twenty-something’s in the gym and often wonder how they REALLY look at life. Themselves. Do they really feel “youth” is a “state of mind”? Or do they really, deep-friggin-down feel that, well…maybe not so much…that they’re actually afraid that at 30-40-50 years “youth is robbed” from the body and you go downhill? That all their fenzied and gnarly death-defying lifestyles and displays of “hotness” are more about the FEAR of growing old and LOSING their “natural” physical and mental abilities, beauty, and prowess? There are always exceptions, of course. I think back to all the “studs and babes” I knew of growing up as a teen and twenty-year-old and look to those of them still around..and it seems that–for the most part–it’s not really a pretty picture. How we think of ourselves really DOES affect how we go through life…how we age. Die. Most of what we do really is dependant upon our mindsets. I’m sure we’ve all had those moments when we were feeling physically “peak,” but our “heart” just wasn’t into whatever it was we were doing…and said “doing”…failed….

    Sorry to go so Zen, here, but this interview really hit the mark (pardon the pun!) for me. Extremely insightful. Great work. Both of you.

    1. Feel free to go zen and drop a pun on my blog any time! Glad you enjoyed the interview, and thanks for reblogging it!

  2. Coming from the other side of the Atlantic the baseball language is difficult for me, but I can certainly get the story and the feeling. We’ve got a guy playing cricket for England for the first time this week whose father, also a cricketer, killed himself a few years ago. And the son has just been hammered by the West Indian fast bowlers in a way that may have ended his career – sports (and writing) have some very tough stories. Another excellent interview: if someone tells the truth we have to read.

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